MMSI and Oil Paint Weathering with Steve Hustad: Episode 127

Welcome to Plastic Model Mojo, a podcast dedicated to scale modeling, as well as the news and events around the hobby. Let's join Mike and Kentucky Dave as they strive to be informative, entertaining and help you keep your modeling mojo alive.

All right, dave, it's our first feature episode of November. We're in a new month. I know man Fall is well and truly upon us now. Well you, getting your mess cleaned up.

Oh, I'm telling you what. The leaves are coming down faster than I can pick them up. Thank gosh there are a lot of podcasts to listen to, because I'm doing a lot of yard work and picking up and grinding up a lot of leaves. But I'm also getting modeling done, which makes me happy. In addition to that doing modeling-related reading, thanks to some friends, I've picked up some modeling-related books. I've got a couple of projects cooking in the back burner because I've got too many front burner projects to get distracted, but modeling's hitting on all cylinders. My only fear is the dark time is coming.

So that's your model sphere man? I didn't even ask and you just rolled with it.

Yeah, I know I've done 127 of these. I know how this works. Okay, how's? Your model sphere Mike.

It's very, very similar. One thing I did want to mention up front here is we'd like to extend our condolences to the family and friends of BJ DeBecker of. Panzer Concepts BJ passed away. I guess it was last week.

Yeah.

Sad thing he's a good guy. I didn't know him that well, but I know he was a pretty big pillar in a large swath of the community and a great designer. He'd done some work for several firms and his Panzer Concepts stuff was always beautiful, oh it was great. He'll be greatly missed. So hats off to BJ and rest in peace.

Yep, amen. What's up in your model sphere?

My model sphere is juggling home life, work and hobbies?

Yeah, you're sending more stuff into space, aren't you?

I've been busy man. We had a busy week at Space Tango and then we had a busy week here at the house with Halloween festivities and all that I don't know. I've actually put some decals on, so we'll talk about that later. So I've got to find my balance again. Yeah, that's always important. I've been doing a hot-cold all-or-none kind of deal and that's not very good for anything. So that's what's up in my model sphere, so hopefully things will get moving now that things are settling down.

Now I'm assuming, since we're recording an episode, you've got a modeling fluid in front of you.

I do, dave. I am enjoying house bourbon whiskey from the West Fork Whiskey Company in Indianapolis, indiana, and this comes to us from Michael Aluzzi, and he surrendered this bottle to us at MMSI. So we'll figure out by the end of the episode what we think of it or what I think of it.

All right, all right. Thank you, michael. Those types of gifts are always appreciated. Mike and I both enjoy our modeling fluids, and the listeners who bring us stuff allows us to sample things that we probably would never get to sample on our own. So thank you.

What do you got?

I've got a Homestyle. It is Homestyle Ale IPA from Bearded Isis Brewing in Nashville, tennessee. So I've never had it before, it's a new one, hang on.

I've never heard of the brewery before.

Oh, that's good, that's going to get me through the episode. No, neither had I, neither had I. I had never heard of this. Now Nashville's growing like a weed and man. Their food and microbrewery scene is just exploding. So it doesn't surprise me that you know there's a brewery, a microbrewery there that we haven't heard of because they're just they're popping up like mushrooms. I'd say there's at least one. Oh gosh, yes, probably a lot. There are a lot. I happen to know and listen. If you haven't been to Nashville lately, nashville's a pretty neat town to visit.

Well, while you're dreaming of Nashville and enjoying your beer, let's get into the listener mail. Man, you got it and I tell you it's been kind of light and we got a lot of emails coming in for a different reason. Well, dave, I hope you have some good stuff on the DM side. I've got one email and it's from Norman Stubbe, and Norman is out of Philadelphia, pennsylvania. He's written in before, but not in a long time, and he had been going having some conversation with Bruce McRae. Oh really, yeah, it's the. There was an item in one of Bruce's dioramas, I believe it is the. Oh, I can't remember the title of it. It's the world. They're pulling the German soldier out of the flooded shell crater.

Oh yes, yeah, I know the one you're talking about the World War I dioramas.

Act of Mercy or something. Yeah something, an Act of Mercy. There it is in the stinking email. I should just look. That's the one with death over on the side. Yes, that's the one with death over on the side. Yes, and he noticed off. In one of the corners of this thing, in the barbed wire, there was something that looked like a sewing machine bobbin.

Mm-hmm.

And he got in touch with Bruce. And, sure enough, bruce had done some research and found an image of a World War I barbed wire spool.

Mm-hmm.

And yeah, it looks like a giant sewing machine bobbin.

No, I guess that kind of makes sense. I mean, it's wire, you'd wrap it around something to transport it, and then the ability to spool it out as you're laying it out. That makes sense. I'd never thought of that before.

Well, it gets into a wheel topic that we'll save for later. But not too hard to guess what it might be, At least the theme of it. But pretty cool, you know, I've seen a sewing machine bobbing somewhere else and I want to say it's a shut-pane diorama.

It could be, but that's neither here nor there. Anyway, I'm glad he sought out Bruce and asked him about it. Man, we need to get Bruce back on sometime. Yes, we did In the next few months Because we're going to miss him down in Middle Tennessee. Allegedly he was going to be down there. If his travel plans hold, then he should be at that show. So we'll have to ask those guys if he did, or ask Bruce. Well, folks, that's all I've got from the listener mail side of things. On the email side, dave, hopefully the direct messages have been a little more fruitful, or?

you already know about if you listen to our last couple of drops. First of all, we've had numerous people reach out to us over DM to ask us if we're going to be at the Murfreesboro show on November 9th. And, guys, we really wanted to. If there was and I mean this is such an easy one for Mike and I, given the distance involved yeah, If there was any way we could do it and maintain domestic tranquility, we would do it. But having just been to Chicago and having been a number of places, I think we're both all out of attaboys and so we got to build up some goodwill.

So we're already planning it for next year. We really want to get down there. Mike and I have been to the Murfreesboro Show a long time ago and have some fairly fond memories of it as a matter of fact. But we're sorry we're not going to be there, but we hope that the guys in Murfreesboro have a really great show, a really great turnout. It's about one of the last shows before Thanksgiving and Christmas and all that stuff hit. So if you can get there, get there.

Yep, I second that and I've talked to Bill Moore about that, because they're going to take care of us, man, but we can't get down there.

We'll do it. We're going to do it next year.

Let's not promise, but we're going to try oh okay, we're going to try real hard.

Second, I want to mention just Chris Meddings reached out to us. He actually was in Berlin and was having a really nice Hefeweizen and he knew I liked them, so he sent me a photo and a DM. And the reason I bring this up is that Chris has sent us a couple of very nice DMs recently regarding how much he's enjoyed some of the recent episodes of the podcast and we really appreciate that. And, chris, I was a little bit jealous of the Hefeweizen in Berlin. I'm going to have to get there sometime. That looked like it was fun.

I spent a month in Berlin in high school.

Yeah well, you weren't drinking beer, I suspect.

You want to bet?

Were you really? It's Germany, man? Well, I didn't know. See, my daughter just went on a European trip with her school, and if you were under 18, you could not drink, and if you were over 18, you had to have a parent's permission slip. So maybe her school trip was much more rigid than the one you were on. Maybe, so, Our friend Christian Gurney at Bases by Bill sent me a DM. That was just really cool. You know how we talked about bases recently.

Yep, I sure do.

They're doing something and this is in 144 scale, but I imagine if it turns out successful, they're going to do it in larger scales. It is a base with a cutout insert space in the middle of the base that you could swap in either a concrete air runway base or you could swap in a PSP base, or you could swap in an aircraft carrier base. You could have a finished base and then you can swap in and out the actual scenic part of the base for whatever model and whatever surface you want to do, and it looks really cool and I can't wait to see and hear more about it. Really cool and I can't wait to see and hear more about it. We got a DM. You mentioned Mike Aluzzi and his lovely gift to us at the MMSI show. Mike was sympathizing with me regarding the fact that fall has come and we were both spending our weekends picking up leaves rather than sitting at the modeling bench. He suggested we change a shirt for the podcast. So Many Leaves, so Little Time, and I kind of like that.

That would be a kind of nice variation. Craig Everson, who goes by Aussie Scale Modeler. He sent us a picture of his completed Tiger I diorama and base and he did a really nice job. It's a really, really attractive model and base and the reason he sent it to us is he got a hold of one of your kilometer markers and it is on the base and it looks really good. It's a little overshadowed by the giant tiger.

It probably is.

It's there if you look for it and it's kind of neat. So, craig, thank you. And, by the way, anybody else who's got one of those kilometer marker bases? If you actually use it on a base, on a model, please send us a picture, because we kind of like to collect those. That's kind of neat. So if you use it on a base, please send us a photo. Dave Waples, out of England, as you remember from a previous DM, our friends at SBS in Hungary were making really nice detailed 70-second-scale engines for the SBD Dauntless and they're for the Hasegawa kit, and I wondered aloud if they would hold of a Flyhawk kit. And they were testing it and they were going to modify it so that it would fit the Flyhawk cow out and says they think they've solved that problem and that within the next week or two they're going to have the SBD engines for the Flyhawk kit, Did they also not?

were they also dissatisfied with the cowling of that kit? Or am I thinking of something else?

They had a difficulty with it. They had a difficulty with it. I don't know if they were dissatisfied with it, but they were having because of the way it's apparently molded, differently than, of course, the Hasegawa kit, and apparently that was causing them some problem. I don't know if it was exactly dissatisfied, but it was presenting them with a difficulty which they've apparently now solved.

Well, I don't know if I misread it or I don't want to misspeak and say they're coming out with something they're not, but just a cursory look at that conversation, I was under the impression that they were going to be doing a cowling for it as well.

They may, I don't know. That's a great question.

Maybe how they fixed it.

It may be. It may be. I'll follow up with Dave. Or Dave, if you're listening, clear that up for us and let us know when they start to market it. That's really. It's good detective work. We might have to assign you an agent number if you keep that up. Joe McCaslin from out in Washington near Jim. He reached out. He heard our interview with Brandon Lowe about the B-24, the planes, names and names and the decal sets that Brandon was talking about. One of the aircraft he was talking about was Double Trouble, which is an aircraft that Joe has a real interest in. He actually did it in 72nd scale and made his own decals for that particular aircraft. He got to meet several of the crew members of the airplane and so that aircraft has a particular, he's got a particular attachment to it and he said that's definitely going to be a wallet breaker that he can't wait to see when it comes out and he is definitely in for all of it.

Well, that's going to be a good one. I'm looking forward to that one too, and just seeing where they go with it, I hope it's a success. They got to get the first one out the door first. Yeah.

And hopefully it sells well. And hopefully that means you know, anytime you have a really good manufacturer who puts out a good product, you know you hope for success for them, simply because that means they'll be able to give you more good stuff. So I can't wait as well. Mike Halliday reached out because he heard you mention that you had picked up a book at MMSI on British soft skin vehicles. It was just a kind of a basic primer beginner book on all the different variations. And he reached out because he had found off of eBay an old Airfix magazine book on RAF vehicles and so he brought that to my attention, which I appreciate because I'm now on the lookout for that item, and it was just very nice that he heard you and thought thought enough to send bring that to to our, and particularly my, attention well, I tell you, that book is.

You know it's not a great book, but it's the one you got, the one I got, and I sent him a picture of the cover or an ebay link the one that was for sale, I think and it makes me want to break out the next one of those Airfix 72nd scale, 76, 72nd scale blister carded kits I've got back in the stash.

Which one? This has got the Bedford truck.

The big Matador truck with the big gun.

Yes, yeah, with the 25 pounder.

Well, it's 155 millimeter. Oh, that's right, it's 15pounder. Well, it's a 155-millimeter equipment. Oh, that's right, it's 155-millimeter.

Well, good, maybe that's once you get this pawl under your belt and the KV-85 going a little further down the road, maybe that's the next one you break out, maybe, maybe.

Finally, I want to mention our friend, stephen Lee, who is a great example of modelers helping modelers. Stephen Lee has heard us talk with Steve Hustad about Steve's love of the Pricer figures and how some of the more desirable sets are really difficult to come by. Well, stephen Lee found a vendor over in Europe who had in stock a fair amount of pricer, including a few of the desirable sets. So Stephen reached out to me to pass me the link to pass to Steve, which I did, and Steve was, as a result, going to place an order. So it was really just a nice way of modelers helping modelers. And this is you know, this is what I found among the modeling community is the number of times people reach out and say, hey, I heard you talk about this, did you know about this or are you looking for this? That's a really, really wonderful benefit to the community we're building and I was happy to see it happen.

Is that all you got, man? That's it, man. You brought us down the road this episode because I didn't have any.

So Well, you had some, but they're all for what we're going to talk about in just a minute.

I don't want it to be that way next time.

Okay, so let people know how they can get a hold of us.

I will. Will folks. You can email the show at plasticmodelmojo at gmailcom or, as a lot of folks did this time, use the Facebook direct messaging system and we'll take care of those again. I love this segment. I love hearing what the community out there has got to say, and let us have a little conversation around their emails and direct messages as a result. So a lot of stuff there. It's a good time.

Well, Mike, we've got something going on. We got a giveaway. Why don't you tell folks?

about it. We do have a giveaway. Plastic Model Mojo and the fine folks at Squadron are giving away a Hobby Boss B24J Liberator Kit in .48 scale, and that's what all these emails have been for. They've been following the directions. We put out a little short detailing that and we mentioned it again in the 12-minute model sphere and I'll mention it one more time because I think it's probably the last opportunity we're going to get Dave.

Yeah.

This giveaway is open to anyone. All you have to do is email us at plasticmodelmojo at gmailcom. It has to be via email.

Yeah, no DMs, no text messages, no smoke signals, email only.

With B24 giveaway in the subject line and if you are a past or present contributor to the show via Patreon, paypal, buy Me a Coffee. We've gotten a few tips. A couple other ways, yeah. But if you've been a financial contributor to Plastic Model Mojo, please put that in the subject line as well. That'll get your name in the hat three times versus one, and in the body of the email. Please give us your current mailing address. We promise not to spam you or sell you off to a bunch of merchants. Your current mailing address. We promise not to spam you or sell you off to a bunch of merchants. It's going to be used to drop ship the kit, should you win, from Squadron directly to your door.

So follow those instructions. If you need them again, you can listen to the episode or you can go back and pick up the B24 giveaway. Short, we did, and it'll all be there. So already got a lot. But you have until the end of the day, end of November 14th, right? So 1159, 59 pm, eastern Daylight Time. So get them in, folks. Maybe you'll win.

If you are listening to this, we assume that you're enjoying it. We would hope that you would go and rate us on whatever listening app you're using to listen to the podcast. Also, if you know a modeling friend who is not listening to Plastic Model Mojo, please recommend us to them. We continue to grow and much of our growth comes from satisfied listeners who are telling their modeling friends. So please recommend us. If the person needs some help downloading a podcast app and subscribing, help them do that so our listener base continues to grow. More people in the community.

Once you've done that, folks, please check out the other podcasts out people in the community. Once you've done that, folks, please check out the other podcasts out there in the model sphere. You can do so by going to wwwmodelpodcastcom. That's model podcast plural. It's a consortium website set up with the help of stewart clark at the scale model podcast to aggregate the banner links and help with the spirit of cross promotions. If you go there you can find all the banner links to the other, to the other podcast. You can just click and go. While I'm talking about Stuart, Scale Model Podcast is going dark for a little while until I guess I don't know how long he said till the end of the month. His wife's having some health problems and he's dealing with a lot of stuff and their show is going to take a backseat to that which it should, is going to take a backseat to that which it should. So, Stuart, we wish you the best and hopefully get through all this and we'll be listening for your return.

Yeah, you're in our thoughts, man.

We got a lot of blog and YouTube friends out there, dave, and we're going to plug those guys. We got Evan McCallum at Panzermeister36 on YouTube. He just dropped a new one on German tank, early war tank interiors. I know I haven't watched it yet.

I need to go check that one out as soon as we're done recording.

That's what I plan to do chris wallace, model airplay maker, great blog, great youtube channel. Always look forward to what he's got coming out. Jim bates a scale canadian tv. Now did I see something from jim?

yes, jim dropped a short and then he's dropping a TV, either last night or he's dropping it tonight. So yeah, he's back in the business.

Steve and Lee SpruPieWithFretz great blog and we mentioned him already. But Steve's a good guy and his content on his blog is really good and thoughtful. So folks check out all those and Paul Budzik Scale Model Workshop. Please go to Patreon and sign up for that. Good stuff, man.

I am stunned by what he's doing to that P26.

I'm not, it's just old school Paul Budzik man. Yeah, I know. Now. I was watching this video where he's machining all this alignment stuff.

Yeah.

I know Now I was watching this video where he's machining all this alignment stuff. For, yeah, I know and I got to wonder and he'll answer this via email when you're watching that close-up video of that center drill hitting into that thing and it drifts down just a little bit, does that bother you at all? Just a little bit. Amazing stuff it is. Yeah, that's the kind of content you're going to get at scale model workshop over on patreon.

So please support paul and his latest endeavor finally, if you're not a member of ipms usa, ipms canada, ipms mexico or whatever your national ipms organization is, please join it. Ipms is a society devoted to modelers, devoted to helping modelers. Much of what they do is done in the background to make modeling and model contests better, also to provide an umbrella for local clubs inside any particular country. If you're not a member of AMPS, the Armor Modeling and Preservation Society, please consider joining If you have an interest in armor or post-1900 figures. They are a great group of guys and gals who are dedicated to bringing out the art of armor, modeling and art. It is indeed. I still am impressed by what we saw at their National and South Bend and I can't wait to go to the one in Pennsylvania.

Well, Dave, let's have a word from our sponsor.

You got it one in Pennsylvania.

Well, Dave, let's have a word from our sponsor. You got it. Plastic Model Mojo is brought to you by Model Paint Solutions, your source for harder and steam-backed airbrushes, david Union power tools and laboratory-grade mixing, measuring and storage tools for use with all your model paints, be they acrylic enamels or lacquers. Check them out at wwwmodelpaintsolutionscom.

Well, Dave, our special segment kind of grew out of our trip to MMSI.

Yes, it did. It also grew out of the fact that you and I both happened to be at the exact same place with our Japanese aircraft, and we needed a little guidance.

Well, and guidance we got and folks are going to get some too. We have a nice conversation with Mr Steve Hustad again, he's always willing to come back on and talk to us. So, Dave, let's not waste another minute and let's see what Steve had to say about MMSI and weather and model airplanes, about MMSI and weather and model airplanes. Well, Dave, we've seen a lot of this guy this year. Yes, we have. In fact, we just saw him a few weeks ago. Steve Hustad, how are you doing?

I'm doing pretty good. How are you guys tonight?

We're great. It was great seeing you at MMSI.

Yeah, ken and I made the trip and that is always such a good show and such a fun show to go to and the guys there do such a great job putting it on.

Well, I'll be honest with you, mike and I used to go to the show a long, long time ago, fairly regularly, and got out of the habit for any number of reasons. I'm super glad that you encouraged slash, bullied us in to going up, because that was really an enjoyable show. I mean, they do a really nice job. The sum of the work is just amazing.

Yeah, it's professionally run Jim DeRogatis and Joe Burton and the other guys there at the MMSI local club. They put on a fantastic show every year and it's this year and in recent years it's been at the Schaumburg Marriott, which, coming from the Twin Cities, saves us about an hour, not having to drive further east into Chicago, so we like the venue.

Who wants to drive further into Chicago right?

Yeah, the show's there, so why go further?

Yeah right.

Yeah.

Well, we had a great time hanging out with you and, as always, well, we've seen you three times this year now. Yeah, yeah, something like that.

Yeah, I dragged Ken Solomon along with me and he loves the show too, so couldn't get him to enter something this year. But I'm as pleased that that mike you got you entered something and scored, so that was good yeah, it was good to meet ken and I'm I'm glad you brought him along.

That was, uh, please extend our our, please extend our greetings to him, because it was really nice to meeting he. He was a really nice guy and you know, like I said, with most modelers, you meet them and you immediately have a rapport with them, just because you have so much in common.

Yeah, that's true. There's never a shortage of things to talk about, and it's been a real pleasure spending time with you guys this year too.

So we enjoyed it. We'll see you again at some point, I hope, and and and plus, you managed to spend some of my money on books. That was, I've got to say I was. I was pleased with the, the vendors and some of the some of the reading material that I picked up oh yeah, that's what I spent my money on too.

And talking to Marty Jurassic of M&M Models and he was showing me the Yonkers JU88G6 digital book that he downloaded- yeah. And so I might have to go out and get your advice on a tablet.

Oh listen, that thing was impressive really. I know you're going to get it and when you do, send me the link, because I'll probably get it. It's just somebody did that as a labor of love.

Oh, they really did, and that's one of my favorite aircraft and so I just had a great time looking through that. He had it printed out and spiral-bounded and so had a great time looking through that. He had it printed out and spiral bound it, and so we're kind of looking at that. But yeah, the MMSI show I think I've been going to that for probably 25 years and only missed a few years, but it's always high class. They raise the tables and they attract international modelers and they attract a lot of the best from around the country.

And and saw a couple of your your podcast brethren, scott gentry and grant mayberry yeah and so it was good seeing them again, and and you guys, and even guys local like greg sealer and andy golden, and oh, it's just a cornucopia of just pleasurable model viewing.

Well, and what impressed me most is and I guess because it is in large part a figure show figures, you get the artistry. The people who do those and do them really well are truly, well and truly artists. I mean, modelers are artists to begin with, but this is just, it allows the maximum expression of that. And man, some of those figures and some of those dioramas and vignettes were just stunningly impressive. You'd sit there and stare at them for five or ten minutes and you'd see something new each few minutes.

Yeah, I think the dioramas are the reason I like to go.

Yes, agreed.

Yeah, and the guys like Bill Horan always puts on a tremendous display. Yeah, and the guys like Bill Horan always puts on a tremendous display and he's kind of one of the kind of artist luminaires of the hobby and his stuff is always just so pleasurable to look at.

Yeah.

But the dioramas and vignettes, that's kind of the heart and soul, I think, of that show and of course they're made up mostly of figures, but in recent years they've really looked like it's expanded the ordnance categories, which usually just includes aircraft, armor ships and such. But that's growing every year and that's getting a lot bigger. And they have a nice section dedicated to box dioramas. And I was talking to Jim DeRogatis about an idea I had for a box diorama, so he's anxious to help me out with that. So I got to pick his brain and get some information. I actually bought some books online by Bjorn Jacobsen. He's a Norwegian modeler that does a lot of LED lighting, usually for explosions and fires, because I had that idea. I'm not sure if I'm going to do it or not, but great books, but it doesn't show you how to make the actual connections and I think Jim has a. Jim's got a great way to do it and of course Barry Biedeger was right there and he's got a more complicated way to do it. Jim says so, jim says his is a way to do it. So I'll talk to Jim, but I've got a good kind of a good ideas for kind of a long-range project, but it's something I do want to do.

But yeah, box dioramas. I think it was last year. I think they had a selection of Chep Payne's box dioramas on display which is really a lot of fun to look at and Jim had been restoring a lot of those so it was kind of fun to see that he had a couple still in progress and kind of fun to see the process. So but yeah, and the ordinance and the figures themselves was kind of the original heart and soul of the show, but I think it's really kind of expanded. You see a lot more fantasy now too, and so it grows. The tables are full and it's just no shortage of things to drool on and take pictures of Yep and then go out and and take pictures of Yep and then go out and have a nice meal.

Yeah, that's you know. Breakfast and dinner and martini hour, those are the best parts. And socializing with your friends. That's the best reason to go.

We managed to do plenty of that.

Oh yeah.

Well, and looking at some of those dioramas some of them happen to be yours and two of them we had seen before and one of them we had not in person anyway, and it was always always fabulous to see those no-transcript, because I think Dave and I are both at a crossroads on our own projects where this could come in handy for us and I'm sure our listeners would would enjoy it as well.

Just a complete coincidence that both Mike and I happened to be right at that point.

Yeah, well, well, it's well, the secret is oil paints. That's, at least that's kind of my secret. So well, it's not really a secret, but it's right. Um, your, your technique. Yeah, that's the technique I use, and and it's I actually. I use oil paints for a lot of things and I've a while a long time ago I used to build 35th scale World War, I figure dioramas.

They are fantastic.

And I got kind of used to oils there. I did most of them with humbrols at that time but I started tinkering with oils and that was kind of where it got the start. And then the current dioramas I do the figures are painted with the oils, the faces with humbrels. And then I kind of got into small scale armor, which we talked about on one other episode, and so I started studying night shift and what he does and and a lot of. He uses a lot of oil paints and a lot of derivatives and he has his. So I learned a lot from the armor modelers and kind of applied it toward aircraft modeling and learned a lot from the figure modelers and applied that toward not only the figures I do but also the aircraft. And some techniques will translate and some won't, but over time you kind of develop your own techniques. So I've kind of added a few things in there along the way.

Well, walk us through your process from. Okay, one thing I learned just recently in interacting with you was the fact that you, in at least some cases, do your exhaust staining or at least some of your exhaust staining prior to even decaling the model, after you've got the model gloss-coated but not yet started to put your decals down.

Right yeah, I airbrush the exhaust staining on after I finish the camouflage.

Okay, and what do you use for the exhaust staining? Okay, and what do you use for the exhausting?

Usually Tamiya XF Series, xf10, which is a reddish brown, and I think XF1, which is a flat black, and I just mix it I think it's like three to one black to brown and airbrush that on. So it's kind of a layering process.

And what do you thin it?

with? Do you thin it with MLT or with their? Acrylic thinner oh I use MLT, okay, the Mr Color Leveling Thinner, and I also add a few drops of the Mr Mild Retarder.

Gotcha.

And together with an airbrush with a fine tip and a low air pressure and very thinned paint you can spray the exhaust stains just like you spray, you know, tight camouflage squiggles or such. So it's kind of the last step I do on that. But actually talking about oil paints and weathering, it all starts with aircraft, actually in the cockpit. So I use a lot of oil paints in the cockpit. I'll spray them with an acrylic base and then give them an oil paint wash and then a lot of people dry brush with acrylics or enamels but should really try some very light dry brushing with oil paints and it might take several layers to build it up but you can get much finer to scale results with oil paint and in cockpits you can kind of manipulate with a small brush.

You can manipulate shadows and highlights with oil paints in cockpits and especially in 72nd scale where we need to kind of accentuate the contrast because of the small scales we work in. It really comes in handy with a little black or dark brown to go underneath structural stringers and the sides of seats and you take a little oil paint and you hit the edges with a lighter color and essentially just pop things out and just the. The whole trick is contrast. You want more contrast for our scale, so it so you can see it better and it stands out. So it kind of starts with the cockpits and then I get the course with talking aircraft. Just get the fuselage together.

Well, let me stop you right there and ask you one question that popped into my mind. So when you use the oil paint, you're using tube oils. Do you apply it? You apply it straight. It's not been thinned with mineral spirits or anything like that, correct?

That's correct.

And do you put it on like cardboard and let some of the linseed oil drain out?

I know Night Shift does that, and I think that works better for armor modelers, because you want it to maybe be a little bit drier when you apply it, gotcha, but for this what I do is I save. I've got probably hundreds of old photographs that I've discarded, and so I cut up the photographs and I use those as an impenetrable kind of palette for oil paints.

Gotcha.

But I apply it. I use just the Winsor, Newton, the Winton oil colors and the 37 milliliter tubes or the 502 abtilong oils and the 20 millimeter tubes.

Those are pretty good too yeah and then there's ak came out with something that's kind of interesting. Ak, true metal comes in tubes. It's kind of a wax, it's well, it says it's a wax, but it's it's. It thins with with mineral spirits, but it's all metallic colors like aluminum, dark aluminum, steel, iron, so you can use those to kind of highlight and paint up steel scuffed floorboards and rudder pedals and things like that and you just apply your, upload this.

So this we're talking about the interiors. Just thin brushes to along edges and crevices to increase contrast.

Right, but you can also do a lot of corrections with oils too. If you missed spraying some area that maybe is supposed to be RLM 66, black gray, but it still shows maybe some primer color, light gray or something, you can take oils, mix up some black and white and a little bit of pain gray and you can mix a color and a little bit of white and you can put it around the edges and you can kind of feather it out from the middle and you can make it look just like the rest of it. So you can do a lot of corrections with it too and now when?

when you dry brush, do you just do you use like a chisel brush, or or do you also still use a small thin?

no, when I dry brush oils I use, do you remember when we were kids and you get those watercolor paint sets that would come on, those tin kind of hinged things? Oh, yeah. And they'd always come with some big, soft, fluffy brush.

Yep.

That's what I use Really. Yeah, you can get some really cheap ones. You can find that. Just make sure that the brush is really soft. Just make sure that the brush is really soft. And I get some that are smallish to biggish and just hit the tops of those and get most of the paint off and you can use those for dry brushing oils and it works beautifully because it's so soft. I think, any brush that is really soft.

You don't want something that's stiff, yeah especially if you're dry brushing over photo etch.

Yeah, and then you might have to apply several layers, maybe 24 hours apart, and build it up. So anyway, the oil paint weathering kind of starts in the cockpits that way, carrying it on, I'll usually paint up the camouflage, the bottom and top camouflage and whatever colors and the exhaust stains, and then hit it with a clear glass coat, you know, future or Mr Color GX100. Apply the decals and then seal it in with a satin, clear coat.

Now, what do you use for your satin clear coat?

Well, I used to try VMS but, like Mike, I wasn't having good experience with it. I'd thin it down a lot and it'd go on thick and it would tend to clog the airbrush. So I kind of switched over. What I do now is I take I still use you can use the Future or the Mr Color GX100, and I mix it with some of the flat base.

Tamiya flat base.

You can use Tamiya flat base or you can use Mr Hobby Aquius flat base or flat clear, just a little bit just to give it a satin finish. So I seal in the decals with that and you want a little bit of a satin finish, not a hard gloss finish for the weathering stage that follows, because of course the oil paints won't stick to a gloss finish that well.

Right.

So that's kind of step. One is prepare the surface with kind of a satin On top of that, assuming that all the camouflage colors are laid down, the exhaust stains are laid down, maybe any panel line accentuation that you might have wanted to do with the airbrush is already in place and your decals and your clear coats are on. And then I take the oil paints and the same Winsor, newton or 502 Abitulon I'm not sure how to pronounce it, but you can mix up a color that matches your camouflage color, one a little darker and one a little lighter. And what I do is with a small brush, again in between panel lines and in between rivet lines, you can hit it with either a lighter or a darker shade that you've mixed, and then with that big, fluffy, soft brush again, after you get in kind of a patchwork, look to it which looks horrible, and you'll be astounded, be just appalled at it.

But when you start using the big soft brush and you kind of whisk over the top of it gently, back and forth and not with any pressure, but you'll see, the thing will just feather out and you'll see that you've got a very slight accentuation from panel to panel using that technique and it's very controllable and you can do it small area to small area and you can stop and come back the next day and pick it up again and you can take some more oil paints and you can mix up a darker color, add a little black, and you can take a really fine brush and go down maybe a rivet line lightly with that and just deposit just a slight amount of a darker oil color right across the rivet line and then use that brush again I talked about and just kind of whisk that brack over the top back and forth and step back and before you know it you've got something that's looking kind of real.

Now do you, when you're using the big, soft, fluffy brush, are you always moving in the direction of airflow?

Usually, but not always. Okay, yeah, sometimes it depends on the effect I'm looking for.

Sometimes it depends on the effect I'm looking for, or if maybe I get overzealous and I blend it too much, then I'll reapply some oil paint and then I'll go back over it the other direction with a little less zeal, Because you're working in oils. You've got plenty of plenty of time to work with these things.

Right, plenty of time. Oh yeah, to work with these things, right? It's not like trying to work with acrylics, where they where you need a wet palette and they dry up quick, and or you're you're trying to dry brush, acrylics or enamels and they dry too quick and you just have to keep renewing what you're doing. The oil paints you can just keep moving, you can correct what you've done if you don't like it. Since you're on an acrylic base, you can just wipe it off with mineral spirits and start over if you don't like the effect you're getting. So it's very forgiving, it's very controllable and it's just a matter of where you want to deposit the lights and the darks. So a lot of what I do is carried over from a lot of figure painting, and I don't know how much you've studied figure painting, but Chep Payne in his book had what he called the stop sign effect.

Yeah.

Where the way a light hits a figure on top would be of course your brightest color, and then of course the octagon to the sides would be a little darker, still lighter than the base color, and then the sides would be maybe the base color and then you get darker underneath and he showed that as kind of a way to shadow probably forearm shoulders versus armpits and that sort of thing, and the same kind of thing. Use the same kind of idea with aircraft and what I do is like the spine of a fuselage or the tops of engine nacelles. You can apply a little lighter colors too, and then when the nacelle goes down and hits the wing and it's got that kind of lower groove along the wing between the wing and nacelle, you can use some darker colors in there, maybe where the maintenance crews come onto the wing to refuel or refill the ammunition containers on the wings, through the wing, you might want to introduce some darker colors or some colors like brown, like maybe a little dirt here and there with the oil paints.

You can just blend it in with that brush and you can go back over it the next day and add a little bit of accentuation.

If you thought it's too subtle, or if you put it on you think it's too much, you can wipe it off and do it again. So just look at photographs and you can see like sometimes you look in an aircraft photograph in black and white from the rear that shows maybe the top of the wing and you look at the wing, and in black and white from the rear that shows maybe the top of the wing and you look at the wing and you'll notice that maybe the inboard part of the wing is maybe darker or lighter than the outboard part. And you can use that kind of on your aircraft. You can do the same effects. And this is on top of the camouflage you've already put on and the oil paint blends so feathers out so beautifully of the camouflage you've already put on and the oil paint blends so the feathers out so beautifully. It doesn't interfere with even two-tone camouflage where you've got a nice soft edge between them, things like that.

So now you talked about taking oil paints and mixing up colors that are analogs of your camouflage colors, but you may be a bit lighter, a little bit darker.

Yeah, I'll mix.

Okay, that's a talent in and among itself is the ability to. Now I've got a color wheel and I know the theory behind it. Right, but actually mixing up colors that are close to the camo colors. How do you go about doing that?

Well, you just have to lay in enough oil paints. I mean I think I've got maybe 12 oil paints Windsor and Newton's that I picked up at Hobby Lobby. There are more Michaels or something, but like yellow ochre and you've got dark olive green and, of course, black and white and you pick up the basics and Payne's Gray. Between black and white and Payne's Gray you can mix up pretty much any underside color you want, including neutral gray or whatever. Or for Imperial Japanese Navy, topside dark green you can pick up a dark green oil oil paint or you can mix the green from. You know blue and yellow. That's a little harder. I'd pick up the green because I'm lazy. I just like to start with something that's quicker. But you can add a little blue to it if you want that cowan ishy kind of dark green, but I usually. It's amazing the colors you can mix up using oil paints. You can almost make anything and it doesn't have to be perfect, it can be just close because you're trying for an accent. And another thing you can do with oil paints I probably should have mentioned right from the start is and armor models or modelers are familiar with that as just filters like panel by panel and a lot of aircraft have panels. You'll see a panel where maybe maybe it's the main panel, where all the fuel access points are on, and you can, you can brush on some heavy coat of oil paints that covers that panel to panel, let it sit and then just wipe it off and you'll get a nice tint. That's a kind of a and I do that before the technique I'm talking about. But you can mix up your camouflage color and then from that you can lighten it with a little bit of yellow, ochre or white, or you can darken it with a little bit of black or whatever color you want to accent it with. So you've got a darker and a lighter compared to the color you have on the aircraft.

And then you can hit panel lines. You can hit rivet lines. You can hit the center of these panels. The center might be just between two crisscross, like a tic-tac-toe board, which is maybe rivets, maybe the center and all the other squares that the rivets define. You can go into each of those and kind of accent them just subtly. Like I say, the highlights may be on the top, the spine and the cells, and the lowlights may be along the wing, root and more seams. But after a while you get the hang of it and you'll develop your own technique. But it's a technique that's really easy and it's really controllable and it's really forgiving because you can wipe it off and start over if you want.

So you've got a 72nd scale single engine aircraft model in front. Let's just pick out a thin air, an ME-109G10 by Edward. Now, who's doing those? Who's doing those?

I'm doing two of them, I know.

That's why we picked it up.

And Mr 109's building.

a couple of them too, and you're both doing the same aircraft in one instance and the interpretation of the camouflage between you and Barry I find fascinating. So I'd love to get you and Barry on together to talk about interpretation of German late war camo colors, because that's a convo. We could start you two talking and I'd just sit there and listen. But back to your Edward 109 G10 that's sitting in front of you, decals, satin, et cetera, and you're ready to start this oil technique From beginning to end. How long does it take you to completely apply your oil technique to a single engine, 109 G10?

How many hours do you think you put in Okay, they're both up to that point of doing and actually they're both past that point now, so I did both of the undersides last night. Took maybe two hours.

And of course that was two aircraft.

That's two aircraft, yeah, and of course I've done it before, so I kind of know where the pitfalls are and know what to do and whatnot. So it's a lot of experimentation too. When you start applying the colors, you'll see what you like and what you don't like and you'll kind of gravitate toward what you like and then you learn how to accent panels and crevices and highlight things that are raised and again, a lot of things, the same things that armor modelers do with the modulation technique. So last night I did the undersides on both of them and this morning, let's see. In the morning I did the wings and the tail planes, top sides, and then the afternoon I tackled and did the fuselages. So maybe for all the techniques on each one, maybe three hours each, okay.

That's not unreasonable From start to finish.

No, and it's a lot of fun. It's a great deal of fun.

Well, let me back all this up to to one point before the martinis, right, yeah, the martinis, that's right that'd be a great place to start yeah, was the foundation for any of this highlighting and shadowing done in your base painting. Are you working off? Are you working off of just the raw color?

oh, yes, no, it's. Sometimes is when I'm dealing with a smaller model like the 109G10s. I didn't. But when I did that G4M1, betty, which is a bigger model with a lot bigger area to cover you're right, mike, on that one I did do some highlighting with the actual base camouflage color with the airbrush. So I did some of that technique with the airbrush because the surfaces were so much bigger, and I did them much in the same way prior to glass coating for decals. I did much in the same way as armor modelers do with the modulation technique.

I think I can do some of that.

So you would take one of the camo. It's a green-brown. For anyone who hadn't seen a picture, the Betty has a camo of green and brown on the top side.

Right.

So if you were, when you're painting you paint the camo colors and then go back with, say, a lightened green and go into some of the centers of the panels of the green areas.

Yeah, like along the top of the fuselage. So you kind of get a head start on the oil paint technique I described. That comes later.

Right.

And the same with, I think, on the Betty too. I also I mentioned airbrushing to accent with ink on the Betty too. I also I mentioned airbrushing to accent panel lines a little bit too, and you can dial down really fine tipped airbrush and kind of hit some shadows with that to start with too, before you get into the gloss coat for decals. So there's a lot of things you can do ahead of time like that, that kind of make it go a little faster later. But it's a technique I enjoy so much I really don't want it to go any faster.

So you build bigger planes yeah, well, I did that.

The at-111. I just finished, though that's um. I did that same technique on there, but that had kind of a squiggle camouflage on the fuselage because it was a night bomber and the wings were kind of black, so I did a lot of black on that overlay.

Now, I've been trying to get you to put your Betty on a mirrored base, because nobody gets to see the underside, and what you did with the underside was, I assume, almost all with oil, because it's a silver underside.

Yeah, natural.

And is it paint, silver or natural metal?

I use the AK Extreme Metal paint and I make three different shades of that and I've got a complete description of that build actually on John Miller's website Model Paint Solutions.

Thank you, that's a good pointer. On John Miller's website, model Paint Solutions. Thank you, that's a good pointer, but you used a lot of oil streaking.

Yeah, those Japanese bombers got really ugly on the bottom. Yeah, yeah, so, which is a lot of fun to do too, but then nobody ever sees it, but it's still.

You know, it's more hours of modeling pleasure right, right, but you have to put that on a mirrored base from now on.

Well, it's kind of run its course and I think it's been to its last show.

But anyway, for something— you can take it to places to display, yeah. I could do that. Take it to a national. Just put it in a display area now that we're doing that more and more at nationals.

But since you bring that one up, I did the same kind of technique with the oil paints on the underside of that, the betty also in that I used more filtering on that, where you lay on a heavy coat of oil paints on certain panels and then wipe it off later after it dries and you get a lot of tinting and then, of course, the typical oil paint pin washes into the panel lines. That's always a good place to start and actually with the 109 g10s, that was where I started was just oil paint pin washes into the panel lines and the rivet lines now, when you do a, when you do a pin wash with oil paint, is that at that time do you thin it with mineral spirits to get it to flow?

Yes.

Okay.

Yeah, so on the top sides of those I used kind of a black and a Van Dyke brown mixture, On the undersides I used more of a black and a Payne's gray, and so that was kind of the starting point. So you get, and of course the Edward 109s, having this nice rivet pattern already built in, molded in you get some accentuation right from the start that way. So the oil paint technique that follows, you're just accentuating what you've already laid down with the pin wash. That works pretty well that way.

Well, if you've gotten well, let me start over.

I've lost my train of thought. Steve, I know where I want to end, you've asked all the questions so far. Oh, I'm sorry Go ahead.

I was going to back up and say one thing. We talked about cockpits and I wanted to mention that I use the same techniques in wheel wells, so which, of course, would be obvious, I guess. But lay down a pin wash and then you can use oil paints to accentuate, and even on flat white areas you can feather it out and, you know, get different colors going, or just tinted areas.

So, moving on from base coats unless Dave hasn't, or you know the basic, basic scheme, unless Dave has another question in that regard, I was hoping to talk some about some of the finer details, like what's your favorite things to do for, like the exhaust flares on the sides of the cowling, or that's one to talk about, and then another one is just generally propellers.

Okay, exhaust stains.

Not just the stains, the sheet metal flares, exhaust flares on the sides. I mean typically I've not looked at a, I don't see many color photos so I don't know to what degree of oxidation or heat Are you talking about the discoloration, the heat discoloration. Yeah, the heat discoloration, the patina on those parts and what you typically do for those.

I had the same question, mike and Steve and I had this conversation a few days ago. Yeah, I was just thinking the same question mike and steve and I had this conversation a few days ago.

Yeah, yeah, I was.

I was just thinking the same thing my paul's got a lot of them and I know dave's yeah, and what does what I do?

and I guess this is the way I do it.

I'm not saying that's the right way, but I will take a fine tipped airbrush and thinned paint and retarder and dial down the pressure and I will, first of all, I'll maybe put a simple mask on where I absolutely don't want the paint to be like the forward part of the cowling, and then you can use that and you can airbrush in at least the basic outline of where the stain is going to be the exhaust stain, basic outline of where the stain is going to be the exhaust stain After I've glass coated it, after I've decaled it, after I've sealed in the decals, after I've done the oil paint weathering and after I've flat coated it or give a I like to use actually something between a satin and a flat Then, using pastels, a lot of exhaust stains.

You'll look at them and they're very dark but they have a center area that's kind of like you say, oxidized or it's got some heat flares or you notice some discoloration or some variation within the exhaust stain itself and you can create those pretty easily and pretty effectively with a fine brush and pastels or pigments.

Like a light gray Right, you see sometimes a light gray, a light brown.

Yeah, I think on the Betty actually they had some topside they have two prominent exhaustings coming off the top of the cowling along the wing and I airbrushed on the basic exhaust stain and then in the center of that using some light gray pastels, just kind of feathered in some of the heat discoloration stain that you sometimes see, and you can kind of feather that out pastels and it looks pretty good. Now Dave asked me could that be airbrushed? And I suppose it could. But you'd have to exercise such control because you're dealing with such a tiny area at that point. It's so much easier just to take a fine triple-op brush and do it with pastels.

Right, and it's much more controllable and correctable if you mess up.

Yeah, it looks just as good.

On the sheet metal flares or pipes sticking out of the cowling.

Oh, the exactual exhaust stacks themselves.

Yeah what are you doing there? I usually hit them initially with like a Humbrell 160, which is a dark red-brown, and then I'll dry brush them with oil. I'll drill out the exhaust stack end itself and put black in there and then dry brush them with a finer brush, with oil paints, just to bring out some highlights. And then I'll, when I airbrush over the initial exhaust stains, some of that will go on the exhaust stack itself and give it a slight tint, so you get something that looks pretty good. Now you go back later on the opening edge of the exhaust stack with a little a fine brush and a little bit of oil paints and you can highlight that so it pops out too anything special you do on your propellers?

yeah, well, most of them are luftwaffe aircraft, so most of them are Luftwaffe aircraft, so most of them are RLM-70 black-green.

But again, I will hit them with a pin wash at the root and you can use oil paints again to kind of feather out. Well, first of all I take oil paint and kind of dry brush the props with like a yellow ochre just very slightly, just so you get the outer blades a little lighter than the inner root just slightly. And then you can take some oil paints at the root and you can kind of darken that where the hub attaches and kind of work that out with the oil paints. And then take a I usually use a Prismacolor pencil and you can highlight the edge of the whole blade out and then you can feather that in with a little more gently applied oil paints just on the edge too. So if you look at a photograph of a propeller, often the blades that are in most contact with the air while it's spinning tend to wear pretty quickly and they tend to be a lighter tone. In black and white photographs I'm kind of trying to replicate that a little bit.

And some props are wood and some props are metal.

Right, but when they're all painted black-green they all kind of end up looking somewhat the same, unless they're busted up, but like the DO-217, that was metal props and that crashed into that lady's garden and of course they're all bent.

Right Of course, and then you can use. Then I use a silver Prismacolor pencil on top of that, but I'll I'll use the dry brush technique before and then use the pencil on top of, and then you can go back with oil paints and fix things and you can use the oil paints to add more shadows and highlights.

And now, just off to go, look, I don't remember, does the Betty have a brown prop?

Yes.

No, it doesn't.

No, I'm sorry, this one had a silver. It was an early Betty so it had natural aluminum fronts and kind of very, very, very dark gray to black rear ends Right Black faces on them.

And then they went to the red, red brown, which the SAM that I'm doing has a red brown prop.

Yeah, Now that wouldn't be perfect for a like yellow ochre. Just get it on that fluffy brush I talked about a little bit of yellow ochre, just very, very little, and just kind of whisk it around the blades and the outer part and and you can go from not each blade on the front and each blade on the back and just until you start liking the effect, just build it up real slow. Of course, the big downside of the oil paints is it takes a long time to dry.

Yeah, but I'm a slow builder, so that's not a problem for me.

Yeah, and even if you're working on models every day and you want to let it sit for a couple days, three days, bring out another model and just get the parts, cleanup work done on it.

Yeah.

You know that's what I do, and then so when you finish.

So you're always making use of your time, your modeling time, and then when you get around to that model again later after these are done, then you know the grunt work's done and you can hit the ground running, mike, unless you've got another question.

I've got one that's a biggie. This, maybe it's the same one. I'll ask it and then if it's not, you'll get to do yours too. Go ahead. Also, stemming from the Betty, and it's going to be something a lot of folks doing the japanese planes are gonna gonna want to know how to do, is? There's a lot of chipping on those points there we go bare metal down to the bare metal. Really real curious, especially like on my e16, because it's that dark, imperial japanese navy green and it's yeah, it's going to show a lot.

Well, the one where this shows on your work, steve, is you did that, rex, and you've got a major amount of chipping and wear along the wing roots on both sides of the fuselage, and it just looks so real that was all done with silver prismacolor pencil on top of tester's dull coat okay so, like it's the last thing you did, it's the last thing I do, and a lot of people will use what they call the salt technique.

You know, they'll paint their aircraft in aluminum and then they'll put the camouflage color on top and then they'll, you know, kind of abrade it to get down to the aluminum. But I've tried that, but I could never get a good scale effect. I could never. That's a 30 second scale trick, yeah, and even if you're really careful, it's, it's just I could just never make it look right. And and the pencil technique is just so easy to control and it's just so easy to apply and it just goes slow and it looks great.

So is there any other than the fact that you're applying it on the final, on top of the final dull for want of a better word dull coat finish? You're just using the pencil on the dull coat finish. Do you do anything to rub it in, to blend it? Do you use silicone brushes? Are you using paint brushes or are you just using the pencil on the dull coat finish?

Just the pencil on the dull coat finish. Just the pencil on the dull coat finish.

That's amazing, because it doesn't look like that on your Rex.

Okay, now there are some exceptions, but usually it's just the Prismacolor silver pencil on top of the flat finish. But if I've got some wider areas of aluminum and I'm using the pencil and I'm covering like bigger areas, then sometimes what you can do is use a like a Q-tip and kind of rub it a little bit and that'll, and the areas you want to smooth out a little more and those will smooth them out. But did you do that on the rex?

because there's some very large patches of bare metal on those wing I think only very selectively, not much at all.

I think I used what I used there. I think might have been one of those. You know how tamiya sells those really thin q-tips yes those. I might have used that in a couple areas, but it was probably 99% pencil just by itself, and that Rex has a lot of the oil paint techniques we talked about too, the lighter and darker panels and the highlighting and shadowing.

Well, and it almost looks sun bleached, yeah it almost looks sun bleached. I mean part of the weathering for that, in addition to all that metal chipping, the finish itself almost looks sun bleached.

Yeah, and that was just using lighter shades and oil paints of the base camouflage colors, like we talked about.

Gotcha like we talked about Gotcha.

And again, you can take darker shades and go over the rivet lines and panel lines a little bit with oil paint too, and blend that in in the same way, just in very, very smaller quantities, and between the two you come out with a pretty good look. But when you guys, when you get to that stage and have any questions, let me know.

Sure will, I guess. One thing you've talked about shifting the colors on the base camouflage and the underside. Is there any treatment you give the actual markings?

Oh yeah, just one kind of thing to be careful about when you put an oil paint pin wash down, and sometimes the pin wash goes over the decals and maybe the decals go over a panel line but maybe the decal doesn't sink into the panel line that well and so the pin wash doesn't show up where the decal crosses the panel line. I go back with a fine brush and you can essentially draw it in with a fine brush and oil paint where the panel line should be over the decal. I think that's a mistake a lot of people make not going back and touching up where the panel lines are, where decals are. So you've got a panel line that goes across a decal and just kind of disappears until it reappears.

Pops out the other side yeah, and so just kind of make sure, and you can kind of draw it in with a 0.3 brush and some oil paints and you can go back with mineral spirits and you can kind of touch up the edges and just just so you have a continuation.

But I don't think that's actually what you're asking, though, mike, it was probably something else uh, yeah, just the uh discoloration, like we had a the hinamaru on the on the betty oh, oh, yeah, it's.

Yeah, you can use on top of the decals, which is, you've got your satin coat on top of the decals. You can mix up a like a dark reddish brown oil paint and you can go on to the hinamaru with that, or a brighter kind of dusty, dusty brown, if it's a really worn look, and you can work in those colors on top of the decal using oil paints also because a lot of times I think that just the the starkness of the markings needs to be knocked down a little bit you know, I remember way back and I bet Dave remembers this IPMS put out some big 8 and half by 11 sheets.

Wait a minute, did you just call me old?

Yeah, because I'm only a few years older than you are, so I figured you probably remember it, and Dave's just, or Mike's just a youngster, so I'm kidding, go on. Yeah, but do you remember those sheets that IPMS USA?

put out Yep, I have them.

Yeah, I do. Were those sheets that ipms usa put out? Yep, I have them. Yeah, I do too. And and now, whenever I use them, I have to brush on a lot of that micro scale decal saver fluid because, right, but they came out with some good sheets where they had weathered versions of the heinemaruse yep and a lot of kit manufacturers.

their heinemaruse are way, way too bright, I think, or they're too orangey, and I really, for the life of me, don't know why the Cal manufacturers don't come out with independent sheets of weathered Hynomeroos, but they don't, and somebody else besides IPMS has done that. I remember AeroMaster had a sheet a long way back, but they were so dark as to be unusable.

Yeah, they had gone too far in the other direction.

Yeah, but nobody else does them. I mean, you find every other decal manufacturer has, you know, sheet after sheet of, like you know, luftwaffe, national markings or Stars and Bars, or British Roundels or a British roundels, but, and they'll, they'll make you know the Japanese Hanamaru's, but they're always this bright red and there's never any options for maybe a, a dusty pink or a, you know, a reddish Brown or something that we all want.

I'm working on the cure for that, because if you cut masks and paint them, you can paint whatever color you want. You can weather them, you can get the underside or the camouflage showing through. There's a lot of things you can do. I just need to spend a lot more time getting a lot better at that.

Yeah, I just wish they'd do it and make it easier on us. So, oh, I was gonna mention one other thing about oil paints the. I use them on my 72nd scale figures. Also, I'd still do the faces with humbrols but and I undercoat them with humbrols, but I do all the uniform and the detail and the weapons. That's all painted with oil paints. And you know, you know light and dark shades of the base color and do a lot with that.

Like I said, the only downside is it takes a long time to dry, but just pull something else out and work on it in the meantime and when it's dry then you can go back to it and it just makes subsequent projects easier because you get the grunt work out of the way and it makes waiting for your current project dry that much easier too. Oh, another thing you do with oil stain there oil paints is I use it to do fuel stains or or engine oil leakage and of course it's perfect for that because it's oil paint right, so you can streak it from a cowling panel line where it's maybe leaking out. You know, look at your photos and you can see, especially on the underside of Japanese engines. Japanese engines were famous for leaking oil.

Oh yes.

And they just got really filthy. And you can have a lot of fun with just streaking oil paints just almost neat right out of the tube and a little bit of mineral spirits to blend it and smooth it and streak it out and so or just to subtly create some fuel stains like around fuel filler caps and wings and things. So so I love oil paints.

All right.

Anything else, Dave.

Nope. Well, one last question In addition to the two 109 G tens, what other project are you working on?

Let's see. I got three others underway that I worked on while I was waiting for oil paints to dry. So one was the Fokker V29 I mentioned to you.

Yeah. Which is a World War I.

It's a prototype, it's a uh it's. It's like a foker d7 fuselage with a foker d8 shoulder wing monoplane wing except the wings a lot. It's a little more in cord and it's a lot more in length. So I had to chop up a an arma foker e5 and get the wing on that. But all the parts are cleaned up and that's that's kind of in the works. And alongside that one I also did a Fokker D7, edward, and my kit was missing one of the critical strut pieces for that. So I sent an email to Edward and about two and a half weeks later in my mailbox there's a section of the sprue that had that piece I was missing. So that's pretty good service.

Yeah, they're good about that.

And the other thing I started is a 72nd scale. It's a FAMO, sdfs, fd, fkz and nine. It's a prime mover Right, mike's probably familiar with those and it's the trumpeter kit. It's kind of like a mini art. It's got like a thousand parts. So so I spent I don't know how many modeling sessions just cleaning up bogey wheels and parts and doing. It's got a lot. Oh yeah, it's, it's a lot just sub assemblies and getting that kind of stuff ready. So and that.

So is that going to be in a diorama?

I'm thinking maybe it might be in a diorama, maybe pulling a Stug 3 out of a swamp or something. I'm not sure, but I'll consult Evan on the Stug.

There you go.

All right, Steve, it's been a pleasure having you back on Plastic Model Mojo.

Oh, it's always a pleasure.

Thanks for having me on pleasure having you back on plastic model mojo. Oh, it's always a pleasure. Thanks for having me on. Well, we we appreciate the tips, as mike and I dive into this very area to break out my oil paints. Yeah, I got some decaling left to do so yeah, you and me both we're good, but we'll be there soon, mike we're moving.

I appreciate all the encouragement, steve.

I'm actually moving again, okay well, good, that's good to hear how long long has it been when you started that, paul.

Oh God, Probably about six months after we started this podcast. But it was always kind of you know, in my defense and it's not a very good one, it was kind of a side project for several other things I had going on.

Right, it was the model you worked on while something else was drying yes, okay, so we can forgive you some of that early on stuff.

Just a little okay, a little bit.

I'm asking for leniency, not, not absolution.

So yeah, okay yeah, the sam's gonna be a fairly quick build. I probably didn't start that less than five, six months ago, so if I can get that knocked out, that'll be a speed record for me.

Well, and once you get to the stage you're at, which is you've got it all painted and it's glassed and you're about to decal it, I mean once it's decaled, I mean it goes really quick.

Oh yeah, Absolutely, Especially when you have all the bits and bobs painted ahead of time. Oh yeah, so you know.

I always make sure I do that, because that's nothing worse than getting ready to finish it up. And then you're faced with painting, landing gear and wheels and propellers and it's like, no, I don't want to do that Exactly. So I do that first.

Smart move. Well, I don't know when we'll see you again, Steve, Hopefully. Heritagecon yeah.

I'll try and make that.

We'll put in an order for good weather.

Yeah, that's the critical part, and got to make the biannual pilgrimage to the road dog.

Who knows, mike and I might meet you in Detroit this year or next year, if you manage to make it, if you manage to go to Heritage Con.

Well, we'll certainly try, because that's that's a great show.

Oh it is, that's fantastic.

All right. Well, Steve, have a great evening and we'll catch up again real soon.

You too Been a pleasure, thank you, thank you.

Well, Dave, I think I'm ready to get my decals on so I can get to that oil paint weathering.

Yep, I'm telling you, it was just so interesting listening to him describe his process, some of which I found surprising, really interesting, and I am anxious to get to the point where I'm very close, but get to the point where I'm very close, but get to the point where I can start trying some of that stuff out.

Well, I'm right there with you, man. I'm slowly working through my project and hopefully we'll get to that point soon, man.

Got to get there soon.

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Helping us with a giveaway in 2024.

Amen.

Well, folks, it's the Benchtop Halftime Report. Hopefully we got something to report. Dave, what do you got? What's going on on Dave's bench?

I got something to report, baby, as people who've been following on the dojo know. I got the paint on the SAM. I've been putting the 30-year-old decals on the SAM. It's been a little bit of a challenge here and there, but nothing major, and it's right to the point where those decals are going to be finished very soon. And then I'll be at the point that Steve just described in the interview and I am going to try out some of those techniques and see what I can do. I'm really, really anxious to try it. I like the way the model's coming out and I need to get something finished. You know what?

makes you feel old. What Using fine molds in 30 years in the same sentence?

Yes, I know, I know, trust me, trust know, I know, trust me, trust me.

I know.

You know what also makes you feel old? What, dave, realizing you started the poll over three years ago. Never mind. The other thing I was going to report on my bench was that the Musaru is moving along. I'm not going to comment on it much, I'm not going to post pictures of it until we get to the reveal, but I will suffice it to say that it's an interesting kit. It's an enjoyable kit, it's an interesting subject and I'm having fun with it. And that's all I'm going to say about the Moosa Roof.

Good man, good man.

All right.

We got to keep our powder dry. We got to keep our powder dry and our way of doing things intact.

There you go. So what's your benchtop look?

like Well, I've got some decals on the paw. I've added the deflection stripes on the top side of the horizontal stabilizer.

And you did not use the kit decals.

You used individual. I'll use the individual stripes from Anis Models A-N-Y-Z yes, okay, from Germany Yep, good stuff, good product. And a? A n y z yes, okay, from germany yeah, good stuff, good product. When I ordered them, I I assume that they would be like a, a full clear sheet with the decals printed on, and I'd have to simulate them myself and have all the challenges of doing it that way before me. But they're not. They're spot clear film printed, even the smallest stripes, nice.

Wonderful product, Although did that give you any problem with curling or anything like? That no I didn't see any of that either. Good, because a lot of times, when you can get thin stripes individually printed, what you can have is a decal that tries to curl onto itself.

I would think one you cut from a continuous sheet would be more prone to do that Maybe. So I highly recommend these. I bought all the colors he offers just because there was an incentive to buy them that way. And you know, you never know.

Well, now I know where I'm going to get my stripes when I need them.

Good stuff. Yeah, again, I highly recommend those and we'll put a link to his website in the show notes. But those came out pretty good. Now, if you really take the time to look left to right, they're not exactly the same.

Which they may not have been on the real aircraft. So let's.

Well, we could take that cop out, but you probably would want them to be on your model. Yeah, well, I know, were I to do it again, I know what I would do differently and that's kind of hard to explain on a podcast.

Then you've learned something.

I have learned something, so there was a better reference on the model than the one I picked. That's it in a nutshell.

Gotcha.

But it was too late when I realized it. Oh, I should have done that instead.

That always occurs to you afterward. Oh, I should have done it that way.

Now I have two of the Hennemer Roo's on the. I've got the ones on the upper surface of the wings. One of them's pretty much on and the other one's about 80% on. It's been through about its third coat of Microsol.

Yeah.

And, depending on how it looks on the one that's already on, I went back and I slit the decal across the panel lines and hit it again. That's probably what I'm going to do again. They're just not and these are Tecmod Heinemarines, they're not the kit decals. So I was a little surprised they didn't snuggle down because the panel lines on this kit are probably on the largest size on the spectrum of panel lines. So a little bit of a surprise, but you know it's no big deal. Working through it, man. All right, Hopefully at the end of the day tomorrow I'll be ready to flip it over and put the bottom wing markings on.

Well, that's what I'm going to do tonight, after I watch Evan's video.

I got to catch you, man, you're going to lap me.

I'd say I am pushing you by pulling you.

Well, I appreciate it, my brother. Not a problem, you working on anything else.

No, Well, I've got some in the wings, but I'm not touching any of them until I get the. I need to get the SAM done and I want to get it done before the dark time sets in, which means I really have to push myself the next three or four weeks.

Well, I'm going to have to move something back to the bench, because this decaling is a lot of hurry up and wait.

Yes, it is, and that's why you really do want to have. When you're at the decaling stage, you want to have one thing you're decaling because you put one or two decals on and then you walk away for a day, whereas that way you can walk over. For me it's the Moosaroo. I can then because it's in construction, so I can do that and then go over to the bench and work on the Moosaroo. But yeah, you need to either bring the KV back out or fiddle with something else.

I guess I will man.

All right, Mike. There's been a lot of kit announcements, a lot of great kit announcements. Have you seen some faves and yawns?

I've seen some things we're going to call faves. They may not be of really vested interest to myself, but they're worth.

They're worth talking about gotcha mine probably aren't as good as yours, because we kind of discussed this a little bit a couple days ago. Yeah, I'll start with my first fave. Yeah, this one I could conceivably see me building, but probably not. It's a pig models. Now. I don't know which of the chinese big three or four they're really affiliated with right, but they are releasing a m4a1 sherman. So an early sherman with the t1 e3 mine exploder, the one with the big, big sets of like laminated steel oversized it looks kind of like a sewing bobbin, a giant sewing bobbin.

It kind of does so I thought that one was interesting. I there's a lot of these quote unquote funnies coming out in like 3d print stuff, but I assume this one's all injection molded plastic, so that's kind of cool. I mean, who would ever thought 20 years ago you'd see something like this in plastic? Exactly I mean, I remember when the nitto kit was the only m4a1 that was out there we live in the golden age of modeling.

My, my friend.

We do what you got first.

Well, I've got all faves and my first one's a double-barrel fave, armahobby, who is quickly becoming my favorite model company. They announced with big fanfare a KI-43 II, a KI-43 II series. That is just awesome looking and the CAD breakdown makes it clear they're going to do multiple versions because there were a lot of versions, the Ki-43. And it's one of my favorite airplanes and I can't wait and I got so excited about this. It just made me super happy.

And then Jim Bates pointed out on their website and they didn't announce this with any fanfare, they just put it up on their website They've got a CAD of a Curtiss Hawk 75 P-36 that in 72nd scale we could use a good P-36 series in 72nd scale Hawk 75. You can do all the French versions, the British version, then they can come out with the US P-36. It's an aircraft that really, really cries out for ARMA taking it on, and so I was super happy to see that I couldn't be happier with a model company than ARMA right now. It just it's fantastic. So I'm looking forward to both of those and all of the kits that I know they will do down the road from those kits.

Well, Curtis Hawk, that's got to be, unless somebody like Special Hobby or someone's done one in the interim.

Yes, special Hobby did a series, az did a series, and they all have their flaws.

But you know, I'm thinking back even older than that.

There's a monogram of the old model or something. Yeah, yeah.

Yeah, built a few of those.

Yeah.

Slap some silver paint on it, that's right, that was modeling, my friend.

That was what's your next?

one. Ryefield has announced an M109A7 Paladin, so this is the big 155 millimeter self-propelled gun. Now this is a new tool, one I know Panda had one and now this Zemi models has re-boxed it after the demise of Panda and there's quite a few A6 types out there from several other companies. But it's a good-looking vehicle. I don't know, it's got to be better than the Panda. I've got some Panda models kits and they're kind of, I don't know, challenging. I don't know. Well, I've never built one so I wouldn't know. But detail-wise they're second tier. Clearly, when you break it, it's like, clearly, when you break it, it's like, oh, what was the one I had? It was a Martyr 1 on the French Lorraine tractor that they had. Then Tamiya came out with theirs and it's just like night and day, right, yeah, even though the Panda one was like it wasn't bad, it's pretty good, but still second tier. So this has got to be a step up. So if folks are into modern vehicles, this ought to be a good one. Well, good, you got another fave.

Yeah, I'm a sick person, I need help. That has announced a series of they're doing national markings for a lot of the smaller air forces Irish, republic of China, just a whole bunch South love small air forces stuff. And this is in my wheelhouse and it is something that is needed because if you're modeling an aircraft from one of the one of the air forces that's not the common Japanese, german, american, french, british stuff that sometimes those national markings can be really hard to find. So having a company do sheets of these things is just a really great idea and I am sure I'll end up with some of them at some point.

Well, my next one's a yawn, okay, and it's kind of a really high-level yawn, and it's not to throw shade on any one manufacturer or company, but man, the 3D-printed armor accessories, there's just a—I don't know. I feel like there's a glut for a lot of it. A lot of folks are doing the exact same stuff. Yeah, and a lot of it. A lot of folks are doing the exact same stuff yeah, and a lot of duplication.

I don't some of these like like Panzer III IV tracks. I don't know how many people are making them.

Right A lot and you know, and if there's one company that's out there that does it and they don't do really good ones, I can see another company coming in and say, okay, we're going to do them right because there's a market there for us. But if there's already four really good sets of Panzer IV tracks out there, I can't imagine any manufacturer going yeah, let's do those as opposed to something else.

I'd be curious from the from the listeners what, what they think of some of this? Because for me personally and I ask because I'm experiencing a lot of stuff getting lost in the white noise- right, because there's just so much so much of it, what other folks are experiencing and and you know evan can probably answer a lot of the track questions, but I I assume he probably gave up on trying to keep up with the new releases from the new companies, not just the new tracks, but right just the companies coming out there making the stuff.

But it's not just tracks, it's all kinds of stuff. Yeah well, like german jerry cans, I mean, come on, how many more? How good can they be? Right, I, are they going to be hollow and you can actually unscrew the lid. I don't know Maybe.

We might get there. Who knows, we might get there. My last one is a tenet of fave and I'm going to ask listeners out there if you've got information to supply it. If you've got information to supply it, there's a company out of Germany called Mobile Factory, m-o-b-a-u Factory and they apparently do 3D printed items and they've got a lot of World War II and pre-World War II civilian vehicles and trucks, cars and trucks, and some of them are really kind of interesting. You know we've all seen the Mercedes V170 or the Packard staff car. You know there's several.

But they've got a bunch of lesser known or lesser common types and I want to know from anybody who has any experience out there do you have these things, what are they like? I can see myself being interested in some 72nd-scale civilian vehicles of more unusual types that you could use in aircraft, dioramas or on bases, or just as a build-in and of itself. So it's a tentative fave. They have a lot of interesting stuff. The question is what's it like? So hive mind, go to it, let me know and I'll be interested to hear.

Well, I don't have any more man. That's it for me.

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We're getting to the end of the episode. How's that bourbon that Mr Alusi provided going down?

It's not bad, but man, it's young. Yeah, there's a trend here with these non-native. When I say non-native, I mean not from Kentucky bourbons.

Right.

A lot of these are newer distilleries, right, and a lot of their bourbons they have that, I don't know. It's kind of an earthy. It reminds me of a peaty scotch, but it's not the same, right. It just kind of reminds me of that, yeah, but it's this earthy kind of leather kind of taste to it. This one's not bad. It's young. I think it just needs to go a little further.

And a lot of that is probably driven by the business itself. If you're a new distillery and you're starting to distill product distillery and you're starting to distill product bourbon, you know you age it at least two years. But really it doesn't become quality until you age it five, seven, ten. But you know a lot of these bourbon distilleries are going to want to start getting some return on their investment. Start getting some return on their investment so you can see where the motivation to release them while they're maybe a little bit younger than you would want them to be and that probably solves itself over time because I doubt these distilleries are releasing everything that they're distilling and so they may release some young but keep some back so you may find out that they're down the road. Their product gets better as it becomes five-year bourbon or seven-year bourbon.

Yep. So this one's young. So don't worry, mr Alusi, it's not a sink pour, it's not like that at all. It's just young. So don't worry, mr Alusi, it's not a sink pour, it's not like that at all, it's just young.

That's the way it is, that's all right.

How's your beer from Nashville?

man. Now it's called Homestyle IPA. It's described as an ale 6.0 alcohol by volume. So it's a middle-of-the-road beer as far as that goes. But it's a middle-of-the-road beer as far as that goes, but it's got a citrus taste to it, very refreshing. And yeah, if somebody handed me this, I would drink it again in a heartbeat. Now, mike, we're at the real end of the episode and all we've got left is shout-outs, and I suspect you and I both have the same shout-out. Our friends over at On the Bench just recorded their 200th episode. If you haven't listened to it, I recommend you go listen to it. It's a really good episode. Davian and Julian are great guys, great podcasters, and we wish them nothing but the best. When we stuck our toe into this space, they were nothing but helpful, accommodating, welcoming, in true Aussie fashion. They're just great blokes. Nothing more than I like than celebrating their success.

Well, I'll second all that. It was a lot of fun. And yes, folks go listen to that one and listen to everyone after, because we got to thank those guys for this space.

We're all in and yes they certainly made it easy for the rest of us to follow on after them and been nothing but welcoming and with open arms. So so, dave, ian and Julian, happy 200th episode, and keep cranking them out, and hopefully we'll see one, two, two or all three of you at some point in their future over here again, so looking forward to that dave and I are already planning for him to come back in 2026 to go up to fort wayne, to the national, and we're going to go down to huntsville to the space and rocket center.

So that's already in the planning stages. So we'll at least see Dave back here in 2026. Any more shout-outs from you? I've got one request from the listeners. Okay, okay, I have a white whale that I need to find and kill. To find and kill. There is a Japanese. The Japanese used a landing craft in World War II called the. It's called the 14-meter landing craft or 14-meter Daihatsu, and there were actually several different versions of it. I have been on a quest to find a set of really good engineering drawings. You know, something that you could use to scratch, build this thing, because that's what I'd like to do, and it's been a multi-year quest. I've come close. I've found some drawings, but nothing that would allow me to do what I want to do. So if there's any listener out there who has access or knows where I can find those, please reach out to me.

Well, Dave, my final shout out is to all the folks who support Plastic Models Mojo through their generosity. We've got a pretty good crop here lately, yes yes.

We have Kurt Kienberg, Stefano Orsi, Bob Johnson and JAK Huey2. No real name there, but I assume that's initials and is the first part of his email address and Jared Strong. All these folks have taken the opportunity to use one of our avenues of contribution to help us out, and we appreciate that very much. So in the show notes, if you'd like to follow along in the path of these guys, in the show notes you'll be able to find links to all the avenues for support for the show that we have to offer. So if you're willing to do that, we appreciate it very, very much. So thank you for that.

Thank. If you're willing to do that, we appreciate it very, very much. So thank you for that. Thank you very much. Anything else, Dave? That's it, man. I think that's a wrap.

As we always say, my friend, so many kits, so little time. We'll catch you on the flip side, man.